Michael Duch — Direct (Part 1) - Day 8 - 2015 Federal Trial

Alex Miller and Gary Luis Alford testified about online accounts and records, Dylan Critten described intercepted counterfeit IDs, and Michael Duch described heroin sales on Silk Road. Cross-examination addressed identity limits, investigative scope and cooperation incentives. The court also reviewed disputed jury instructions.

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Michael Duch — Direct

DirectDirectMichael Duch — Direct

MR. TURNER: The government calls Michael Duch to the stand.

THE COURT: Mr. Duch to the stand, please.

(Witness sworn)

THE COURT: Mr. Duch, it will be important to pull up your chair and adjust the microphone how ever it's comfortable for you so that you can speak clearly into the mic.

MICHAEL DUCH: Thank you very much so much.

THE COURT: Mr. Turner, you may proceed, sir.

MICHAEL DUCH, called as a witness by the Government, having been duly sworn, testified as follows:

DIRECT EXAMINATION BY MR. TURNER:

MR. TURNER: Good afternoon, Mr. Duch.

MICHAEL DUCH: Good afternoon, Mr. Turner.

MR. TURNER: How old are you?

MICHAEL DUCH: I'm 40 years old.

MR. TURNER: And where did you grow up?

MICHAEL DUCH: I grew up in Orange County, New York.

MR. TURNER: And what's your educational background?

MICHAEL DUCH: I graduated high school with a Regents diploma. I also attended three years of college. I went to Orange County Community College, Baruch College here in New York City, as well as Brookdale College out in New Jersey. I also attended or and participated in a variety of technical education courses for computers.

MR. TURNER: And what occupation have you held most of your life?

MICHAEL DUCH: I've been a computer consultant. I've worked in networking in security.

MR. TURNER: In 2012, how were you employed?

MICHAEL DUCH: I was self-employed. I owned my own business.

MR. TURNER: What kind of business was it?

MICHAEL DUCH: It was a computer consulting company, again, focusing on networking and security.

MR. TURNER: The name of the company?

MICHAEL DUCH: The name of the company is called COMM-LAN.

MR. TURNER: And what kinds of IT jobs did your company do?

MICHAEL DUCH: It was mainly servicing business-to-business type stuff, a variety of different doctor's offices, surgical centers, law firms, sometimes do residential work as well. If some of the clients liked the services that we provided, we also did work for some of their home stuff as well.

MR. TURNER: How much money were you making per year in about 2012?

MICHAEL DUCH: Um, about $75,000 a year after all expenses were paid.

MR. TURNER: You're in prisoner's clothing today; is that right?

MICHAEL DUCH: That's correct.

MR. TURNER: Are you currently in jail?

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I am.

MR. TURNER: When were you arrested?

MICHAEL DUCH: I was arrested in October of 2013.

MR. TURNER: Where were you arrested?

MICHAEL DUCH: Outside of a post office in Monroe, New York.

MR. TURNER: What were you doing at the post office in Monroe, New York?

MICHAEL DUCH: I was attempting to deliver at the post office packages of heroin.

MR. TURNER: How many packages were you trying to mail out?

MICHAEL DUCH: Somewhere between 20 and 25.

MR. TURNER: Why were you mailing out packages of heroin from the post office?

MICHAEL DUCH: Well, I was involved with Silk Road. I was a seller of drugs on Silk Road and that was one of the -- that was the method that I used to deliver those drugs.

MR. TURNER: I'm going to ask you some questions about your activity on Silk Road in a minute, but let me first ask, after you were arrested, did you cooperate with authorities?

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I did.

MR. TURNER: And the assistance you provided, was that initially about Silk Road or something else?

MICHAEL DUCH: It was some about Silk Road, but it also -- but I also helped with a control buy with one of my suppliers.

MR. TURNER: So what specific crime -- did you end up pleading guilty?

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I did.

MR. TURNER: What specific crime did you plead guilty to?

MICHAEL DUCH: Conspiracy to distribute drugs.

MR. TURNER: Have you been sentenced yet on that charge?

MICHAEL DUCH: No, I have not.

MR. TURNER: How many years in prison could you get on that charge?

MICHAEL DUCH: Up to 40 years in prison.

MR. TURNER: Do you face any mandatory minimum prison term?

MICHAEL DUCH: There's a mandatory minimum of five years on that charge.

MR. TURNER: And as a result of the assistance you gave to authorities, did the government give you a cooperation agreement?

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, they did.

MR. TURNER: And what does your cooperation agreement require you to do?

MICHAEL DUCH: The cooperation agreement requires that I be truthful, honest and I don't commit anymore crimes.

MR. TURNER: And are you testifying today pursuant to that cooperation agreement?

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I am.

MR. TURNER: Now, if you satisfy your obligations under your cooperation agreement, what's your understanding of what the government will do for you?

MICHAEL DUCH: From my understanding is that the government will submit a 5K letter, and that letter pretty much states that, you know, I've been cooperative.

MR. TURNER: Who does that letter go to?

MICHAEL DUCH: That goes to my judge.

MR. TURNER: The judge who will sentence you?

MICHAEL DUCH: That's correct.

MR. TURNER: Okay. What do you understand the government will put in that letter?

MICHAEL DUCH: That I've been cooperative and I've been truthful, honest, haven't broke any crimes, and my judge will take that into consideration upon sentencing time.

MR. TURNER: And is it your hope that based on that letter to the judge you'll get a lighter sentence than you might otherwise?

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, it is. That's my hope.

MR. TURNER: If the government writes that letter, will you still face that mandatory minimum of five years?

MICHAEL DUCH: I can still face that mandatory minimum of five years; that's correct.

MR. TURNER: If the government writes that letter, will you get out from that mandatory minimum?

MICHAEL DUCH: I do have the ability to get sentenced below that mandatory minimum of five years; that's correct.

MR. TURNER: So what sentence do you hope to receive as a result of your cooperation?

MICHAEL DUCH: I hope to receive time served.

MR. TURNER: Even if the government writes that letter to your sentencing judge, is there any guarantee that the government's given you that you'll get a sentence of time served?

MICHAEL DUCH: Absolutely not. It's absolute completely up to my judge.

MR. TURNER: For any particular sentence has the government guaranteed you?

MICHAEL DUCH: None whatsoever.

MR. TURNER: Will the jury's verdict in this case have any effect on whether the government writes the sentencing letter to your judge?

MR. DRATEL: Objection.

MR. TURNER: Has the government told you that?

THE COURT: I'll allow it.

MICHAEL DUCH: Can you repeat the question, please.

THE COURT: Why don't you rephrase.

MR. TURNER: Sure.

MR. TURNER: Is it your understanding that the jury's verdict --

THE COURT: Why don't you say "the outcome of the case."

MR. TURNER: Is it your understanding that the outcome in this case will have any effect on whether the government writes the sentencing letter to your judge?

MICHAEL DUCH: It should have no impact on whether the letter is written or not.

MR. TURNER: And what happens to your cooperation agreement if the government learns that you haven't been truthful today?

MICHAEL DUCH: From what I understand, the letter won't be written and I can face up to 40 years in jail.

MR. TURNER: Do you have any history of drug addiction?

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I do.

MR. TURNER: Are you clean today?

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I am.

100

MR. TURNER: How long have you been clean?

101

MICHAEL DUCH: About a year and-a-half almost.

102

MR. TURNER: Were you using drugs at the time of your arrest?

103

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I was.

104

MR. TURNER: Have you ever used drugs since then?

105

MICHAEL DUCH: No, I have not.

106

MR. TURNER: What drugs were you -- do you -- in terms of your drug addiction history, what drugs have you been addicted to in the past?

107

MICHAEL DUCH: Mainly heroin, as well as opiate painkillers.

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MR. TURNER: How often did you use those drugs when you were addicted to them?

109

MICHAEL DUCH: On a daily basis several times a day.

110

MR. TURNER: And when did you first develop a drug addiction problem?

111

MICHAEL DUCH: I believe it was in about 2007 or '08 when I initially had some battles with addiction.

112

MR. TURNER: And did you get addicted to painkillers at that time?

113

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I did.

114

MR. TURNER: And where did you get those painkillers?

115

MICHAEL DUCH: From my doctor. I suffered from a few different sporting injuries and those sporting injuries required -- well, didn't require, but you know, it helped that I took those opiate pain relievers, and being that I took those opiate pain relievers for an extended period of time, I developed an addiction.

116

MR. TURNER: And then what happened?

117

MICHAEL DUCH: Well, the opiate pain relievers didn't really provide the same level of relief. Over a period of time, I developed a tolerance. At that time, I had also got painkillers from other people on the street besides my doctor, and I eventually found out that heroin was a -- was just as effective as the painkillers and it was also cheaper. So, you know, developing a tolerance, not being able to afford my habit to the painkillers, I turned to heroin being a cheaper alternative and it was also much more potent.

118

MR. TURNER: How much heroin did you start using?

119

MICHAEL DUCH: It was somewhere about 30 bags per day.

120

MR. TURNER: And by bags, what do you mean?

121

MICHAEL DUCH: Individual little glassine bags that they're sometimes called stamps.

122

MR. TURNER: How long did your heroin addiction continue?

123

MICHAEL DUCH: To about 2007 up to about 2009.

124

MR. TURNER: And did your use of heroin increase or decrease over time?

125

MICHAEL DUCH: It increased.

126

MR. TURNER: Why is that?

127

MICHAEL DUCH: Again, I developed -- I continued to develop a tolerance and was addicted to the heroin, so more of the drug was required to achieve the same effect.

128

MR. TURNER: Did you run into any trouble with the law during this time?

129

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I did.

130

MR. TURNER: What happened?

131

MICHAEL DUCH: I was arrested on several occasions for failure to turn over a controlled, dangerous substance to law enforcement.

132

MR. TURNER: And were you arrested for anything else?

133

MICHAEL DUCH: I was also arrested for I believe it was a burglary shoplifting charge.

134

MR. TURNER: Was that shoplifting charge connected to your drug addiction at all?

135

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, it was.

136

MR. TURNER: How was it?

137

MICHAEL DUCH: Well, I wasn't able to afford my addiction, so to pay for my addiction, so I actually wound up shoplifting some items from a Target store.

138

MR. TURNER: And how much did you start spending on your heroin addiction?

139

MICHAEL DUCH: It was probably about 200- to $300 a day.

140

MR. TURNER: So at some point, you got clean?

141

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I did.

142

MR. TURNER: When was that initially?

143

MICHAEL DUCH: Initially, it was in October of 2009.

144

MR. TURNER: And did you ever develop an addiction to drugs again?

145

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I did.

146

MR. TURNER: And when was that?

147

MICHAEL DUCH: That was in about October, maybe September of 2012.

148

MR. TURNER: And what drug did you become addicted to?

149

MICHAEL DUCH: Painkillers.

150

MR. TURNER: And did you start using painkillers regularly again?

151

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I did.

152

MR. TURNER: Did you develop a tolerance to them again?

153

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I did.

154

MR. TURNER: Did you start using any other drugs around this time?

155

MICHAEL DUCH: I also began to use heroin.

156

MR. TURNER: And how much heroin did you start taking?

157

MICHAEL DUCH: Again, about 30 bags a day.

158

MR. TURNER: How would you ingest it?

159

MICHAEL DUCH: Initially, I snorted the drugs, but over time, I began to inject the drugs.

160

MR. TURNER: And what would happen if you didn't take it?

161

MICHAEL DUCH: Um, I would start to become ill and go through withdrawal symptoms. Those symptoms included sweating, vomiting, diarrhea, extreme flu-like symptoms.

162

MR. TURNER: How long did it take for those withdrawal symptoms to start?

163

MICHAEL DUCH: Within a few hours usually.

164

MR. TURNER: So how often did you have to keep up the use of heroin to stop the withdrawal symptoms?

165

MICHAEL DUCH: Every few hours, several times per day.

166

MR. TURNER: Did you quit using painkillers after you started using heroin?

167

MICHAEL DUCH: I continued to use the painkillers. Over time, I probably used more heroin than painkillers.

168

MR. TURNER: Why did you continue using the painkillers?

169

MICHAEL DUCH: So you know, at the time I lived with my girlfriend and I also maintained a job so, you know, it was something that I tried to conceal from my girlfriend, my family member -- my family members, people who I worked with so, during other times when I wasn't able to discreetly use heroin, I would use the painkillers, you know, like on a weekend or if I needed to be at a job or something.

170

MR. TURNER: So at some point in 2012, did you start buying drugs on the Silk Road website?

171

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I did.

172

MR. TURNER: How had you heard about it?

173

MICHAEL DUCH: Probably through one of the news media outlets.

174

MR. TURNER: And roughly when did you first visit Silk Road?

175

MICHAEL DUCH: It was in October of 2012.

176

MR. TURNER: And what drugs were you looking to buy?

177

MICHAEL DUCH: Painkillers.

178

MR. TURNER: And why were you looking to buy painkillers at that time?

179

MICHAEL DUCH: Well, I -- again, I had become addicted to them and to stave off any withdrawal and/or sickness, I looked to Silk Road to get those painkillers.

180

MR. TURNER: And had your previous supply -- was it no longer available?

181

MICHAEL DUCH: That's correct. It was no longer available. I was under the care of a doctor at the time who was prescribing those painkillers and that prescription was no longer being filled.

182

MR. TURNER: So, what about heroin? Were you looking to buy heroin on Silk Road?

183

MICHAEL DUCH: No, I wasn't.

184

MR. TURNER: Why not?

185

MICHAEL DUCH: Well, I knew of a local supplier that I could go to and it was cheaper for me to get it there.

186

MR. TURNER: So did you start buying painkillers on the site?

187

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I did.

188

MR. TURNER: And did the site work?

189

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, it did.

190

MR. TURNER: You got what you ordered?

191

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I did.

192

MR. TURNER: Besides painkillers, did you ever buy any other drugs on Silk Road?

193

MICHAEL DUCH: On a few occasions, I did, yes.

194

MR. TURNER: What other drugs?

195

MICHAEL DUCH: I purchased heroin on one occasion, cocaine on a couple of occasions, ecstasy, as well as hash.

196

MR. TURNER: And why did you order cocaine and ecstasy? Did it have anything to do with your opiate addiction?

197

MICHAEL DUCH: No, it didn't. I think maybe I was under the influence at the time and, you know, it was available. I don't necessarily know anybody who has those things and being that the website that I was on had them, I purchased them through the site at that time.

198

MR. TURNER: So when did you start dealing drugs on Silk Road?

199

MICHAEL DUCH: I initially started dealing drugs I believe it was in April of 2013.

200

MR. TURNER: And what led you to decide to do that?

201

MICHAEL DUCH: Well, my prescription painkiller addiction as well as heroin addiction became very expensive, and I could no longer afford it, so I resorted to dealing drugs on Silk Road.

202

MR. TURNER: How much heroin were you buying off the street for yourself in a given week at that point, April 2013?

203

MICHAEL DUCH: My tolerance increased to the point where I would use anywhere between 60 and 100 bags of heroin a day.

204

MR. TURNER: And painkillers, too?

205

MICHAEL DUCH: And painkillers as well.

206

MR. TURNER: So how much were you spending per week back then on drugs?

207

MICHAEL DUCH: At a very minimum of $2,000 all the way up to about $3,500 a week.

208

MR. TURNER: How much were you making a week from your IT job?

209

MICHAEL DUCH: Well, that decreased over time. I wasn't able to necessarily maintain the level of service that was required for my job to perform adequately, and, you know, the income from my main job, which was computers, decreased.

210

MR. TURNER: How much were you making compared to the 3500 you were spending a week?

211

MICHAEL DUCH: I wasn't able to afford my habit.

212

MR. TURNER: So where were you getting the money at the time to buy your drugs?

213

MICHAEL DUCH: Well, being that I was successful for a period of time, I did have some money saved up. So once I used up my savings, I then turned to dealing drugs.

214

MR. TURNER: And what drugs did you start selling on Silk Road?

215

MICHAEL DUCH: Mainly heroin.

216

MR. TURNER: You had used drugs before this, right, but had you ever dealt drugs before?

217

MICHAEL DUCH: No, I had not.

218

MR. TURNER: Had you ever considered selling drugs on the street?

219

MICHAEL DUCH: Never.

220

MR. TURNER: So why were you willing to deal drugs on Silk Road?

221

MICHAEL DUCH: Well, I think, you know, being successful in purchasing drugs on Silk Road, I saw the relative ease that came with it. There was a certain amount of perceived level of safety as well as anonymity; and as long as you follow the rules of the site, it seemed like something that I could potentially -- to potentially get away with.

222

MR. TURNER: When you say safety, safety from what?

223

MICHAEL DUCH: Safety from being pursued by law enforcement.

224

MR. TURNER: Now, you were addicted to drugs at the same time, right?

225

MICHAEL DUCH: That's correct.

226

MR. TURNER: Didn't you have any misgivings about selling addictive drugs to other people?

227

THE COURT: Can you rephrase.

228

MR. TURNER: Did you have any misgivings about selling addictive drugs to other people?

229

MR. DRATEL: Objection.

230

THE COURT: I'll allow it.

You may answer.

231

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I did. It was something that bothered me on a daily basis.

232

MR. TURNER: So how were you able to bring yourself to do it on Silk Road?

233

MR. DRATEL: Objection.

234

MICHAEL DUCH: Well, I think there were a couple --

235

MR. DRATEL: Objection.

236

THE COURT: Overruled.

237

BY MR. TURNER:

238

MR. TURNER: Go ahead.

239

MICHAEL DUCH: I think there were a couple of factors that brought me to that point: One is I had an addiction that I needed to feed. It was something that I didn't enjoy doing. It was something I didn't like doing. But to help ease the -- ease my moral conscience, I believe that my drugs -- my drug use continued to increase.

240

MR. TURNER: So what did you have to do on Silk Road to become a vendor?

241

MICHAEL DUCH: Essentially, you needed to log onto the site, create a username, log onto the site and agree to the terms and conditions of the site.

242

MR. TURNER: Could we put 121B on the screen. Can you pull it pup.

243

MR. TURNER: Do you recognize what you see on the screen?

244

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I do.

245

MR. TURNER: How do you recognize it?

246

MICHAEL DUCH: I believe this is the seller's agreement and it requires you, prior to selling drugs on Silk Road, you needed to agree to these terms and conditions of the seller contract.

247

MR. TURNER: And did you see this when you tried to create a vendor account on Silk Road?

248

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I did.

249

MR. TURNER: It says "Get your products to your customers as quickly easily and anonymously as a Silk Road independent seller. Please read the following contract and the seller's guide carefully by clicking 'I agree' at the bottom. You agree to abide by the guidelines and terms below when selling on Silk Road."

Did you read the seller's guide?

250

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I did.

251

MR. TURNER: And what did you understand to be the guidelines and terms you were agreeing to?

252

MICHAEL DUCH: There were a couple of different guidelines that were recommended and that you needed to follow. One was utilizing some stealth shipping methods that were mentioned in the forums. You also needed to agree to the conditions of the site to pay commissions to the Silk Road website for transacting business.

253

MR. TURNER: So did you click "I agree" at the time?

254

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I did.

255

MR. TURNER: And who did you understand to be the other party to this agreement?

256

MICHAEL DUCH: My understanding is that it was Dread Pirate Roberts.

257

MR. TURNER: And who did you understand Dread Pirate Roberts to be?

258

MR. DRATEL: Objection.

259

THE COURT: Overruled.

260

MICHAEL DUCH: I did not know the identity of Dread Pirate Roberts. I was just under the impression that this individual had run the Silk Road website.

261

MR. TURNER: Once you entered into this agreement, did you ever have to communicate with Dread Pirate Roberts or DPR directly as part of being a vendor?

262

MICHAEL DUCH: I didn't have to. No.

263

MR. TURNER: You said that one of the rules that you had to agree to was to use the site's payment system?

264

MICHAEL DUCH: That's correct.

265

MR. TURNER: As a buyer on Silk Road, had you had any personal experience with vendors who had gone outside the personal -- had gone outside the Silk Road payment system?

266

MICHAEL DUCH: I had read some things about people going outside of the payment system. Part of the understanding of using Silk Road is to never go outside of their payment system. There was an escrow system that was set up and in place for making payments, and it was recommended to always use that escrow system and to never release funds to any potential seller prior to receiving product.

267

MR. TURNER: So did you set up a separate account to use as your vendor account on the site as opposed to the buyer account used earlier?

268

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I did.

269

MR. TURNER: What was the username you chose for your account?

270

MICHAEL DUCH: It was called deezletime.

271

MR. TURNER: How do you spell it?

272

MICHAEL DUCH: D-E-E-Z-L-E-T-I-M-E.

273

MR. TURNER: Did you have to pay anything to Silk Road to start up that account?

274

MICHAEL DUCH: There was some initial money that was put in escrow.

275

MR. TURNER: How much money?

276

MICHAEL DUCH: I believe it was about $500.

277

MR. TURNER: And what was the purpose, as far as you understood, of that payment?

278

MICHAEL DUCH: Once you established yourself and proved yourself as a reliable seller on Silk Road, that money was later returned to you.

279

MR. TURNER: How were you supposed to prove yourself reliable and dependable?

280

MICHAEL DUCH: By delivering the products, by delivering drugs in my case, to the sellers in a timely and efficient manner.

281

MR. TURNER: You mean to the buyers?

282

MICHAEL DUCH: To the buyers, that's correct. I'm sorry.

283

MR. TURNER: And how was that supposed to be -- how was that feedback supposed to be received by the website?

284

MICHAEL DUCH: So, as part of the website, there was also a feedback system. And any time that there was a transaction, a buyer was afforded the opportunity to leave feedback regarding the drug transaction. So as long as the drug transaction went well, you received positive feedback. The more positive feedback that you received, that was realized throughout your experience on the website.

285

MR. TURNER: So, the $500 was a deposit?

286

MICHAEL DUCH: That's correct.

287

MR. TURNER: And if the feedback showed that you were actually dealing drugs, you got your $500 back?

288

MICHAEL DUCH: That's correct.

289

MR. TURNER: Once you made that deposit and set up the account, how did you advertise your heroin on Silk Road?

290

MICHAEL DUCH: Well, I created some listings. There were generally three different listings that I created: One for an individual bag, another one for ten bags, and another one for what's called a brick of heroin, which is equivalent to 50 bags.

There was some sellers who --

291

MR. TURNER: Let me interrupt you. Would you take a look at Government Exhibit 700, please, in your binder in front of you. Do you recognize that document?

292

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I do.

293

MR. TURNER: How do you recognize it?

294

MICHAEL DUCH: I recognize it because it has my user account mentioned in the top-right corner, and this is essentially a way to update your profile on the Silk Road website.

295

MR. TURNER: Does this fairly and accurately reflect the contents of your vendor page as of the time you were arrested? Let me make sure you're looking at 700. A or B?

296

MICHAEL DUCH: I think that's what I'm looking at. I think I might be looking at the --

297

MR. TURNER: Take your time.

298

MICHAEL DUCH: There we go. Thank you. Yes, this was the -- my vendor page, right before my arrest in 2013.

299

MR. TURNER: Okay.

300

MR. TURNER: The government offers Exhibit 700 into evidence, your Honor.

301

MR. DRATEL: No objection.

302

THE COURT: Received.

303

(Government's Exhibit 700 received in evidence)

304

MR. TURNER: So deezletime, that was your username?

305

MICHAEL DUCH: That's correct.

306

MR. TURNER: Could we go over here. Actually if we can zoom in there.

307

MR. TURNER: Okay. So it says Featured listings, East Coast Style heroin stamps X10 (3 Free!!!) $98. East Coast Style Heroin Stamps X50 bags (1 Brick) $346.

Were these the -- what are we looking at here?

308

MICHAEL DUCH: Those are essentially listings that I created on the Silk Road website.

309

MR. TURNER: And what do these terms mean? What does East Coast Style Heroin mean?

310

MICHAEL DUCH: The way heroin is packaged and distributed throughout the New York metro area, excuse me, is it's packaged in individual little glassine bags and they're sometimes referred to as stamps because of the stamp that is put on the outside of the bag with ink giving it some type of name.

311

MR. TURNER: So what stamp -- examples of stamps that would be on your product?

312

MICHAEL DUCH: A few that I recall would be Black Magic, Murder, Hotshot.

313

MR. TURNER: And what was the approximate weight of each bag?

314

MICHAEL DUCH: They weighed somewhere around ten milligrams each.

315

MR. TURNER: And the brick you mentioned before, brick is -- what is that again?

316

MICHAEL DUCH: That's equivalent to 50 bags of heroin.

317

MR. TURNER: The price is displayed in dollars, but how did you receive your payments?

318

MICHAEL DUCH: All payments were received in bitcoins.

319

MR. TURNER: Did you have the option of displaying your price in dollars?

320

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I did.

321

MR. TURNER: No images on the listings. Was that your choice?

322

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, it was my choice.

323

MR. TURNER: Why was that?

324

MICHAEL DUCH: There's something called geo-tagging and any time that you take a digital photo, you can more or less identify where that photo was taken, so I chose not to put any photos in there to try to evade law enforcement.

325

MR. TURNER: Back up, please. Go here.

326

MR. TURNER: This gray area, by the way, did you control what text appeared here?

327

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes. And I did update that frequently.

328

MR. TURNER: So here it says: "Update, 9/27/2013. We will not be shipping any product on Saturday 9/28/2013. All orders received after 3:00 p.m. EST on Friday 9/27/2013 will be shipped on Monday 9/30/2013. We repeat...no Saturday shipments on 9/28!!! All orders will be shipped on 9/30. We apologize for any inconvenience and thank you all for your continued support."

Can you back out and go to and focus on this for the time being.

This is from a little while before. It says "New Stamp...Fire!!!New Stamp. Revised Saturday cutoff time. Cut-off time for Saturday 9/21/2013 is 12:00 p.m. EST. All orders received prior to this time will be shipped same day. All orders received after 12 noon will be shipped on Monday 9/23/2013. We repeat cut-off time for 9/21 is 12 noon."

What are you talking about in these updates?

329

MICHAEL DUCH: Essentially I'm mentioning the cut-off times in which I needed to receive orders. So if anything I received before 3:00 p.m. that day would usually get shipped out the same day. If there were any changes to that policy, I tried to make updates to my vendor page letting potential buyers know that, you know, you needed to either change your plans, get the orders to me earlier, change the dates and/or times that, you know, that things would be shipped out.

330

MR. TURNER: Was fast shipping something that you specifically advertised?

331

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, it was.

332

MR. TURNER: Same-day shipping?

333

MICHAEL DUCH: Same-day shipping, that's correct.

334

MR. TURNER: Why did you think your customers cared so much about fast shipping?

335

MICHAEL DUCH: I think that users of heroin, they want to make -- they want to know that their product is in the mail when they order. I mean, it's something that they need to kind of listen to because they're going to go through withdrawal symptoms. Most people who develop heroin addictions will go through withdrawal symptoms. These buyers wanted to make sure that they put their money in escrow, that their package was in mail.

336

MR. TURNER: How did you communicate with your customers on the site?

337

MICHAEL DUCH: There was essentially a mail-messaging system that was within the Silk Road website.

338

MR. TURNER: And would you get messages from your customers about shipping times?

339

MICHAEL DUCH: All the time every day.

340

MR. TURNER: Take a look at Government Exhibit 704 in your binder. Do you recognize these -- what's in this document?

341

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I do.

342

MR. TURNER: How do you recognize it?

343

MICHAEL DUCH: They are messages from buyers asking about a variety of different things. Mainly, it appears that they're wondering if their products have been shipped out that day.

344

MR. TURNER: And are these messages that you received in your vendor account in your dealing with Silk Road?

345

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, they are.

346

MR. TURNER: The government offers Exhibit 704 into evidence.

347

MR. DRATEL: Objection as to hearsay and Vayner.

348

THE COURT: All right. Those objections are overruled. Government Exhibit 704 is received.

349

(Government's Exhibit 704 received in evidence)

350

MR. TURNER: Could we take a look at the top one, please. August 9, 2013 from wigglyworm, subject: confirmation. Message: "Hey bud, just need some confirmation on if my package will get to me tomorrow. I made the 3:00pm deadline by at least a few hours so I'm hoping everything will go smoothly. Otherwise I'm gonna be sick for the beautiful weekend we have coming up here in NY... I know I can count on you to be as reliable and professional as possible, so just get back to me as soon as you can. Thanks!"

Can we go to the fifth from the top.

This is from August 15, 2013 from moderngoose: "hello!! first time customer with you here, just wanted to make sure but as soon as my btc hit my account im going to order ur 10 stamp listing via express and i wanted to make sure that as long as i order them around 12:30pm EST will they ship out today as well? i see ur cutoff time is 3 i just wanna double check because i am EXTREMELY dope sick and NEED something by tomorrow!! :( i am miserable at the moment having not slept all night tossing and turning not to mention getting actually sick :/ but anyways thank you very much for ur time, please respond asap. MG"

Can we go to page two, the third from the top here.

September 3, 2013. "Hello. Hey deezle, i placed the order on the 31st... I understand there's been a few straggls aside bt is there anyway you could ship it overnight. I am throwing up, the worst of the worst withdrawl symptoms and plus i have life destroying pain."

351

MR. TURNER: Was it relatively common for you to get messages from your vendors indicating they needed the drugs right away because they were dope sick?

352

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes. I received those messages every day.

353

MR. TURNER: Could we go back to Government Exhibit 700, please. Let's go to page two. This is also from your vendor page?

354

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, it is.

355

MR. TURNER: And it says "Shipping/Packaging. We absolutely will go to the greatest lengths possible to provide our clients with the most advanced packaging and shipping methods available. We ship USPS Priority and Express at this time. There is a slight up charge on whatever USPS charges as the cost for our stealth and packaging is not cheap and is time consuming."

Jump to the second paragraph.

"You will also find that our packaging processes use stealth methods to prevent detection as well as the latest technology in MBB and sealing."

356

MR. TURNER: What does MBB mean?

357

MICHAEL DUCH: MBB is a -- it stands for moisture barrier bag.

358

MR. TURNER: "The bottom line is that you know that your package will arrive there" -- excuse me -- "will arrive as there will never be anything that we do that will make your package look suspicious if accidently opened and the vapor transfer transmission rates of our materials are the lowest currently available in the industry." What are you talking about here?

359

MICHAEL DUCH: Moisture barrier bags are something that I use to package the heroin inside of. Inside of each moisture barrier bag, it's engineered to have what's called a vapor transmission rate. That vapor transmission rate can potentially prevent law enforcement or drug-sniffing dogs to potentially not smell the drugs that are inside the package.

360

MR. TURNER: Take a look at what's been marked in your binder as Government Exhibit 701.

361

(Continued on next page)

362

MR. TURNER: Take a look at what's been marked in your binder as Government Exhibit 701.

Would you flip through the pages in the binder, in that exhibit.

363

(Pause)

364

MR. TURNER: Do you recognize what's in these photos?

365

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I do.

366

MR. TURNER: How do you recognize them?

367

MICHAEL DUCH: It's consistent with the name of the stamp that I shipped as well as the shipping method that I used.

368

MR. TURNER: What is it? What are the photos of in the exhibit?

369

MICHAEL DUCH: Essentially we've got an Express Mail envelope. Inside of the Express Mail envelope is a silver moisture barrier bag.

370

MR. TURNER: I just asked you is this a package that you yourself shipped?

371

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, it is.

372

MR. TURNER: The government offers Exhibit 701 into evidence.

373

MR. DRATEL: No objection.

374

THE COURT: Received.

375

(Government's Exhibit 701 received in evidence)

376

MR. TURNER: Publish the exhibit. OK.

Could you zoom in on the address.

377

MR. TURNER: The return address is "I sold it on eBay in Wayne, New Jersey." How did you choose that return address?

378

MICHAEL DUCH: EBay is obviously a common way for people to resell products that I sold on eBay with an eBay reselling company located out of Wayne, New Jersey. I essentially just Googled eBay resellers and used that legitimate address as a return address to ship my order.

379

MR. TURNER: You didn't have any actual association with that company?

380

MICHAEL DUCH: None, whatsoever.

381

MR. TURNER: Could we go to the next page.

382

MR. TURNER: What are we looking at here.

383

MICHAEL DUCH: This is an Express Mail envelope, and inside of the Express Mail envelope is a silver moisture barrier bag.

384

MR. TURNER: Would you go to the next page.

And what are we looking at here?

385

MICHAEL DUCH: Inside of the moisture barrier bag there is a hair towel. It was common for me to purchase cheap items like hair towels, CD holders and try to hide the heroin inside of those products.

386

MR. TURNER: Could you go to the next page.

So what are we looking at here?

387

MICHAEL DUCH: Wrapped up inside of the hair towel there is another moisture barrier bag and that is custom cut to fit the specified order.

388

MR. TURNER: Would you go to the next page. Could you zoom in.

So what are those?

389

MICHAEL DUCH: Those are individual bags of heroin and around them appear to be some rubber bands.

390

MR. TURNER: Could you go to the next page.

Is that a closeup of the heroin?

391

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, it is.

392

MR. TURNER: So each one of these is -- what is that?

393

MICHAEL DUCH: Each bag is an individual dose of heroin, or what's called a stamp.

394

MR. TURNER: And where did you learn all of these packaging techniques?

395

MICHAEL DUCH: I learned most everything through the Silk Road website. On the forums there are a variety of different methods that were recommended in trying to come up with techniques to prevent detection by law enforcement.

396

MR. TURNER: And how did you package the drugs without leaving fingerprints behind?

397

MICHAEL DUCH: Each time that I would leave the package or anything, I always wore gloves.

398

MR. TURNER: Where did you base your activity out of? Where did you package the drugs?

399

MICHAEL DUCH: Everything was done from my home.

400

MR. TURNER: Where was your home?

401

MICHAEL DUCH: In Orange County, New York.

402

MR. TURNER: And where did you buy the drugs?

403

MICHAEL DUCH: In Passaic County, New Jersey.

404

MR. TURNER: And where did you ship the drugs from?

405

MICHAEL DUCH: I shipped the drugs from my home but utilized the United States Postal Service for shipping.

406

MR. TURNER: And what areas were those Post Offices in?

407

MICHAEL DUCH: Mostly in Orange County.

408

MR. TURNER: Anywhere else?

409

MICHAEL DUCH: I think I may have used a New Jersey Post Office once.

410

MR. TURNER: If you would go back to Government Exhibit 700. Go to page 3.

Let's see. If you could go here.

All right. It says: "In the event that SR goes down you can reach us at BMR ("deezletime") and Atlantis ("deezletime"). We will be using these accounts daily as well.

What are BMR and Atlantis?

411

MICHAEL DUCH: Atlantis and BMR are other sites that were also -- that I also had accounts at that I also sold drugs at. BMR stands for Black Market Reloaded.

412

MR. TURNER: Were they similar to Silk Road?

413

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes.

414

MR. TURNER: Were they similar in size to Silk Road?

415

MR. DRATEL: Objection.

416

THE COURT: You need to lay a foundation.

417

MR. TURNER: How much of your -- well, from viewing the sites, could you see the number of vendors on those sites compared to Silk Road?

418

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, you can.

419

MR. TURNER: So how do the number of vendors on those sites compare to Silk Road?

420

MICHAEL DUCH: Silk Road had a substantially more amount of --

421

MR. DRATEL: Objection. Hearsay.

422

THE COURT: Hold on.

423

MR. TURNER: Personal observation.

424

(Pause)

425

THE COURT: I will allow it.

426

MICHAEL DUCH: Silk Road had a substantially larger amount of sellers that were on there.

427

MR. TURNER: Let me ask you this. How many of your orders came from BMR and Atlantis as compared to Silk Road?

428

MICHAEL DUCH: Silk Road was probably over 99 percent of all orders I received.

429

MR. TURNER: By the way, why did you need to deal on any of these websites? You are a tech guy, right?

430

MICHAEL DUCH: Right.

431

MR. TURNER: So why didn't you just launch a solo drug dealing business yourself on the Tor network?

432

MICHAEL DUCH: Well, yeah, I potentially did have the technical capability, but there was an infrastructure that was already in place and that was known to be Silk Road and it was successful. There was a lot of sellers that were there. I know as a buyer I was successful in obtaining product as well.

So there was the, you know, already established infrastructure, the buyers, there were sellers. And there was a fair amount of publicity that the site had already received. So there was constantly new clients or new buyers that were already there.

433

MR. TURNER: When you say there were already sellers there, how is it helpful for you to have -- to enter into a marketplace that was already full of sellers?

434

MICHAEL DUCH: Well, I mean, without sellers there aren't going to be any buyers. So, I mean, you know, if there aren't any sellers, then there aren't going to be any buyers that are coming to the website.

435

MR. TURNER: So it is the buyers that ultimately --

436

MR. DRATEL: Objection.

437

THE COURT: Why don't you rephrase the question.

438

MR. TURNER: Sure.

439

MR. TURNER: So in terms of what ultimately drew you to Silk Road, was it customer base; is that fair?

440

MICHAEL DUCH: It was the customer base, that's correct.

441

MR. TURNER: And what was involved technically in setting up a vendor page like we saw on Government Exhibit 700? Is it easy to do?

442

MICHAEL DUCH: It was extremely easy to do.

443

MR. TURNER: Can we take a look at Government Exhibit 700A?

Do you see it in front of you?

444

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes.

445

MR. TURNER: What is that?

446

MICHAEL DUCH: That is the vendor profile page. This page is used to update your profile on the page that we were looking at previously.

447

MR. TURNER: The government offers Exhibit 700A into evidence.

448

MR. DRATEL: Objection as to hearsay.

449

THE COURT: Government Exhibit 700A is received. The objections are overruled.

450

(Government's Exhibit 700A received in evidence)

451

BY MR. TURNER:

452

MR. TURNER: So explain what we are looking at here.

And could we zoom in here.

453

MICHAEL DUCH: Sure. So this is the profile description. When you wanted to make any updates to your vendor page, you would essentially type it in right in that profile description. When you click the update profile button, whatever you typed in that box there would update to your profile page.

454

MR. TURNER: Could we back out. There are some options at the bottom here. One of them is post-commission pricing, pre-commission pricing. What did that mean to you?

455

MICHAEL DUCH: There were different ways that the money that was taken by the Silk Road website was taken from you as a buyer. You can choose it either pre-commission or post-commission, but it is actually included in the price to the seller or if it was something that you paid after the transaction took place.

456

MR. TURNER: So, either way, was a commission taken on every sale that you did on Silk Road?

457

MICHAEL DUCH: On every sale, that's correct.

458

MR. TURNER: Could you take a brief look at 700B.

459

(Pause)

460

MR. TURNER: Do you recognize this exhibit?

461

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes. This is a page used to create a new listing within your vendor profile.

462

MR. TURNER: The government offers Exhibit 700B.

463

MR. DRATEL: Hearsay, your Honor.

464

THE COURT: Why don't you build more of a foundation for that with this witness.

465

MR. TURNER: Did you yourself use a page like this to create your listings on Silk Road?

466

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I did.

467

MR. TURNER: And does this exhibit fairly and accurately reflect your recollection of what that page looked like?

468

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, it does.

469

MR. TURNER: The government offers 700B into evidence.

470

MR. DRATEL: It still is hearsay, your Honor.

471

THE COURT: All right. The objection is overruled. Government Exhibit 700B is received.

472

(Government's Exhibit 700B received in evidence)

473

THE COURT: Let me ask you if we could go back to 700A for one moment?

474

MR. TURNER: Yes, your Honor.

475

THE COURT: Mr. Duch, did you use each of the setting boxes that are referenced on 700A?

476

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I did.

477

THE COURT: And did they perform the functions indicated? In other words, "Change Password" had in fact changed a particular password?

478

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, it did.

479

THE COURT: Is that true for each of the functions on that page?

480

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, that's true.

481

THE COURT: Thank you.

You may proceed, Mr. Turner.

482

MR. TURNER: Thank you, your Honor.

483

BY MR. TURNER:

484

MR. TURNER: OK. 700B. So you just put in the title of your listing, the asking price, quantity you had available, and then description down below; is that how it worked?

485

MICHAEL DUCH: Pretty much. You just type in, you know, a title, how much you want to charge, the quantity, maybe how many you had on sale, and a brief description of what it was that you were selling.

486

MR. TURNER: So where did you get your heroin supply from?

487

MICHAEL DUCH: From a street-level dealer in Passaic County, New Jersey.

488

MR. TURNER: How often would you pick up heroin from your supplier?

489

MICHAEL DUCH: One to two times per week.

490

MR. TURNER: How would it be packaged when you picked it up?

491

MICHAEL DUCH: It was packaged in individual little glassine bags. The glassine bags were wrapped into bundles of ten. Each --

492

MR. TURNER: The bags were stamped when you picked them up?

493

MICHAEL DUCH: That is correct. The bags were already stamped with some type of brand on them or name.

Each -- there were ten bags in each bundle. They were wrapped in individual -- wrapped around with rubber bands, and the rubber bands were then wrapped around a larger set of rubber bands which had 50 bags of heroin in them, and that was equivalent to a brick of heroin. Around the 50 bags of heroin there was some magazine paper, and they were all taped together to contain all of the heroin.

494

MR. TURNER: And how many bricks would you generally buy at a time?

495

MICHAEL DUCH: Up to 40 bricks of heroin.

496

MR. TURNER: And how much did your supplier charge you? How much did that cost you?

497

MICHAEL DUCH: Each bag was $3. So it was about $6,000 for each time I picked up heroin.

498

MR. TURNER: And how did that street price compare to what you were able to sell the drugs for on Silk Road? How much was your markup?

499

MICHAEL DUCH: I generally tried to keep it somewhere around double that. So about 100 percent.

500

MR. TURNER: So you were just taking the same heroin you were buying off the street and putting it up for sale on Silk Road at a hundred percent markup?

501

MICHAEL DUCH: That's correct.

502

MR. TURNER: How were you able to sell at such a high markup?

503

MR. DRATEL: Objection.

504

THE COURT: Why don't you rephrase.

505

MR. TURNER: Why did you think you would be able to sell at such a high markup?

506

MR. DRATEL: Objection.

507

THE COURT: I will allow it.

You may answer.

508

MICHAEL DUCH: Well, there were -- being that Silk Road had access to a large geographic region, there was -- some of these areas didn't necessarily have --

509

MR. DRATEL: Objection.

510

THE COURT: Well, ladies and gentlemen, this answer is for the witness' perception. It is not offered for the truth as to whether particular areas did or did not in fact have access to heroin.

You may answer.

511

MICHAEL DUCH: OK. There was a -- from what I understood, there was -- the heroin was not available in the geographic regions all over the United States, and, you know, so somebody out in Utah was now able to gain access to the heroin. So, you know, it wasn't something that was necessarily available to them, but the Silk Road website made that available to them.

512

MR. TURNER: Did you know where your customers lived, where you were sending the heroin -- not "lived," but did you know where they were receiving the shipments you were sending them?

513

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes. Well, I would get their addresses through the Silk Road website.

514

MR. TURNER: And did you keep a record of the transactions you did with your customers on Silk Road?

515

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I did.

516

MR. TURNER: What records did you keep?

517

MICHAEL DUCH: Essentially, I created a spreadsheet that tracked all the business that I conducted, all the drugs that I sold on Silk Road.

518

MR. TURNER: Did you keep your customers' addresses?

519

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I did.

520

MR. TURNER: You weren't supposed to do that under Silk Road's rules, right?

521

MICHAEL DUCH: No, I wasn't.

522

MR. TURNER: But you did it anyway?

523

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I did.

524

MR. TURNER: Where did you keep that information?

525

MICHAEL DUCH: I kept it on my computer at home.

526

MR. TURNER: And was your computer seized by law enforcement as part of your arrest?

527

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, it was.

528

MR. TURNER: Do you see Government Exhibit 703 in your binder?

529

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes.

530

MR. TURNER: Do you recognize what's there?

531

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I do.

532

MR. TURNER: What is it?

533

MICHAEL DUCH: It is a CD with my initials on it and a date that I created it.

534

MR. TURNER: And when did you create it?

535

MICHAEL DUCH: On the 23rd of January.

536

MR. TURNER: Of this year?

537

MICHAEL DUCH: Of this year, that's correct.

538

MR. TURNER: And what's on this spreadsheet -- excuse me, what's on the CD?

539

MICHAEL DUCH: This should be a spreadsheet containing a variety of different information, information that I used to track my orders on Silk Road.

540

MR. TURNER: Did this come from the data that you kept on your computer?

541

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, it did.

542

MR. TURNER: May I approach, your Honor?

543

THE COURT: You may.

544

MR. TURNER: Your Honor, the government moves Exhibit 703 into evidence and asks that it be published to the jury.

545

MR. DRATEL: No objection.

546

THE COURT: Received. Government Exhibit 703 is received.

547

(Government's Exhibit 703 received in evidence)

548

MR. TURNER: OK. Can we zoom in.

549

BY MR. TURNER:

550

MR. TURNER: Would you walk us through these columns and what each reflects.

551

MICHAEL DUCH: Sure. Column A was the order number. This was generated by the Silk Road website.

Column B was the quantity of heroin or the number of bags of heroin that was ordered on the website.

Column C was an adjusted quantity that I created. Traditionally with the -- some of my orders, I would give extra bags of heroin. So this adjusted quantity was something that I created later to reflect the actual number of bags of heroin that I distributed.

552

MR. TURNER: Just to be clear, is that something you created in preparation for testifying today?

553

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I did.

554

MR. TURNER: OK.

555

MICHAEL DUCH: Column D is the postage method used. I essentially used two different ways to ship stuff -- united States Postal Service Express and Priority.

Column E would be the address.

G is the buyer on Silk Road. That is their -- that is their username.

And Column H was the tracking number that I also kept track of for that particular order.

556

MR. TURNER: Ms. Rosen, just to show the jury how far this goes down, could you scroll down slowly.

557

(Indicating)

558

MR. TURNER: A little faster. Keep going.

Go all the way down to the end, please.

559

(Indicating)

560

MR. TURNER: OK. Could we go back up.

561

MR. TURNER: What time span does this spreadsheet cover?

562

MICHAEL DUCH: Essentially from when I first started selling drugs on Silk Road up to the day I was arrested.

563

MR. TURNER: Now, the address information from this document has been redacted, but did you prepare any kind of summary of all the places you mailed shipments to?

564

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I did. Essentially, I extracted all of the cities and states where heroin was shipped.

565

MR. TURNER: Can you take a look at Government Exhibit 703B in your binder.

566

(Pause)

567

MR. TURNER: Do you recognize that document?

568

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, I do.

569

MR. TURNER: What is it?

570

MICHAEL DUCH: It is the -- it is all the cities and states that were extracted from the spreadsheet.

571

MR. TURNER: The government offers Exhibit 703B into evidence.

572

MR. DRATEL: Objection. Hearsay.

573

THE COURT: That objection is overruled. Government Exhibit 703B is received.

574

(Government's Exhibit 703B received in evidence)

575

BY MR. TURNER:

576

MR. TURNER: Could you zoom in here.

It is in alphabetical order?

577

MICHAEL DUCH: Yes, it is.

578

MR. TURNER: Aberdeen, Mississippi; Agawam, Massachusetts; Aguadilla, Puerto Rico; Akron, Ohio; Alanson, Michigan; Albany, New York; Albemarle, North Carolina, etc.

How many pages does this go on for?

579

MR. TURNER: Actually, scroll through the pages, Ms. Rosen.

580

(Indicating)

581

MICHAEL DUCH: It is probably about 15 pages here or so.

582

MR. TURNER: And are the locations concentrated anywhere in particular, or are they spread all over the country?

583

MICHAEL DUCH: They are pretty much spread all over the country.

584